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MiamiAlum17
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 3:20 pm    Post subject: Post-Game Discussion... Reply with quote

It's that time again...

team not prepared again!

The game has passed him by, time to go Charlie

Give us Wojo
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wow...sounds a little extreme to me.
fwih the guys are just not hitting their shots and making (or just getting called for) stupid fouls. it happens...
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RSR
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

live by the three, die by the three
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RSR wrote:
live by the three, die by the three


Ditto

Charlie cant shoot for the guys - but maybe after performances like this - he ought to shoot the guys.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MiamiAlum17, Please change the topic of this thread before I have to.

THREE GAMES DOES NOT MAKE A SEASON.

Calm down. It's early, and this kind of talk about firing a coach is complete and utter nonsense.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I took it as heavy sarcasm - I really hope it was.
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trumpetdaddy
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Sweet 16 team started 4-2. Same winning percentage as this team, just over twice as many games. Everyone just needs to settle down and realize that there is a long way to go for this team.

By the way, a bad loss at Xavier was one of those 2 losses in the first 6 games that season. This team destroyed Xavier, an admittedly weak XU team, but destroyed them. Butler doesn't lose that often OOC at Hinkel Fieldhouse. Not a lot of shame in the loss, just stuff to work on.

I believe that many folks on this board were singing the praises of Temple University's sports program, by which I can only assume primarily the bball program. Chaney is lionized for scheduling very tough in the OOC to prepare his guys for conference and tourney play. Charlie has done the same thing. The guys were not gonna be undefeated, and anyone who thought they were was high.

Duke and Kentucky will both lose a game or two this year. Why are we to be any different? Perspective folks, it's a long season and the conference schedule is what matters
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ha. So it's changed to "Postgame Discussion." Laughing
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 7:07 pm    Post subject: charlie Reply with quote

there was obviously some sarcasm in the post

but seriously, does anyone really love Charlie that much that you are willing to accept mediocrity? Charlie is a great guy, I like him as a person and I think he is a good basketball guy, but it's so redilculous how un-disciplined our team and how unready we were to play against Butler. YOu know we are going to go through stretches where we can't score, so I put it on Charlie to find other ways to win.

I think a younger more energetic coach could bring better talent to Miami.

I know you can't fire a coach after three games, but jsut when you think we've gotten over our problems of fouls, TO's and poor shooting, we revert back to our old ways. It starts with the coach, this is unacceptable... if we demand more, we will get more
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't believe beating Purdue and Xavier is "mediocrity". Losing to Butler by 13, not good. Shooting percentage not good. To much reliance on the 3 today, probably. But I wouldn't call for CC's head this season just yet. No one could seriously think we were going to go undefeated. A bump in the road. As for recruiting, that is a chant I have been leading the past two years, but CC's recent signees (Dierkers, Fletcher and Bramos) are an excellant class, at least on paper. In my opinion, the best in the MAC-hands down. So let's not panic just yet. How did you like that Mattsledge-Bluesman defending CC!!
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't post here over the last few seasons (because I did not know mht existed), but if I had, I would have been screaming for CC to hire an offensive coordinator.

This season began with talk of a new offense, and it looked like the PUrdue game and the first half of the X game we ran some attacking, progressive stuff. But in the second half of the Xavier game, we got a lead and went back to last year's offense, and it let X have a shot of getting back in the game. Not good.

Let's see what happens over the next few weeks, if CC stays with the new, or reverts to the old.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An outsider's perspective:
Quote:

Nov. 23 vs. Hofstra, University Hoops Classic L, 64-67 0-1
Nov. 24 at Robert Morris, University Hoops Classic W, 83-55 1-1
Nov. 25 vs. Cal-Irvine, University Hoops Classic W, 75-64 2-1
Nov. 28 vs. Kentucky, (Cincinnati, Ohio) L, 68-82 2-2
Dec. 1 CHATTANOOGA, W, 75-56 3-2
Dec. 15 at Youngstown State, L, 70-75 3-3 (YSU won 3 games that season.)
Dec. 20 at Xavier L, 56-62 3-4

That was the beginning of the 30 win, Elite Eight season, 2001-02.
Ball State that same year had the best Nov./Dec. of any MAC team ever and then did not make the MAC final or the post-season.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

=>Unlike Purdue and X (which played mostly man), Butler zoned us.

Peavy got into foul trouble which made matters worse for Miami to attack down low.

Miami is a disciplined team.

******

Miami got outplayed and outcoached. Butler's weave opened too many shots. The zone D shut down our offense. It happens.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Charlie seems to be having a difficult time giving the team enough freedom to really push the ball. I think we plan to run, and practice running, but as soon as we make a mistake in trying to push the ball it seems like it is more than CC can tolerate. In both the X and The Butler games as soon as the team made an error when pushing the ball CC got upset and reigned the troops in a bit. It is difficult to change the way you coach, but we look good when we push the ball and are agressive offensively. Chet and Hatch can make up for the mistakes with some easy hoops. This year we have enough ballhandlers and shooters to push the ball agressively. This team is still discovering itself, but for the first time in several years we have the personnel to be more agressive and to take it to the opposition. Today when we were not hitting we reverted to recent seasons when we had bad shooting games; guys became hesitant and lost their agressiveness.
Don't think I am down on CC. He has done a great job with this team, we have a chance to be really good before the year is over....I am not sure what the rotation is going to be yet, and I don't think the coaches are either. Butler had all their starters back and have an established rotation; playing them early in the year on their home court was a very tough matchup. I see us having more longrange potential this year than they do, though. Today Peavy and Monty and Hausfeld gave us almost nothing. These guys should be able to deliver consistant performances and be guys you can count on; today they failed. Penno and T. Pollitz played quite a bit; I am not sure if they are going to be moving up in the rotation or not. I see quite a bit of competition between team members for playing time; it will be interesting to see how this works out.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I travelled with mollautt to the game, and concur with his assessment. Further, the difference between this game and the XU and PU games is that our shot selection -- and consequently made shots -- was not nearly as good today. Butler's interior defense had a lot to do with this. The zone stymied our entry passes and saw us passing too much around the perimeter.

Danny and William had good games -- the Butler announcing crew actually seemed rather pleased that they had limited Danny to less than his season average, even though he still got a double-double. But Peavy's foul trouble, Monty's single point, and Josh's zero points were all factors in the game. They combined for three points -- as opposed to 17+ points a game the trio were averaging so far this season. And Chet was held to less than half his average.

This game isn't a season breaker, but it does show that we won't hit 2/3 of our three pointers every game for the rest of the season, and it does show that we need to score in other ways than behind the arc. Unfortunately, it also shows that until we do that, teams are going to zone the heck out of us.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

three other semi-related notes about the media:

1. Butler's pregame had the same format -- down to the same ads and sponsored segments -- as Miami's. I half expected Bake to come on and announce for BU!

2. I wish Bake would have. Their guys were horrible! During the post-game, it sounded like the radio guys must have been playing the point and center, with as many "we" and "our"s as they were throwing out. Obviously all radio folks are tilted towards the home team, but these guys sounded like they thought they had suited up!

3. Their radio guys had also only done minimal scouting of Miami -- probably just printed off Miami's game notes off of MURedHawks.com. I can't recall the specifics, I just recall looking at mollautt and saying "huh?" The team they were describing was not the Miami I know....
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hell. Between this an Davidson, I oughta just throw in the towel and root for Carolina for the rest of the year. Twisted Evil

Riiight. Because that's what I'd do. We had a bad game. One bad game! Last I checked, we had played three games of a 27-game season. That means there are 24 to go.

Random statistic of the day: Michigan State is 11th of 12 in the CCHA standings right now. Do you expect that to continue? I sure don't. There's a lot of hockey--and a lot of basketball--left to be played. You can't throw away a whole season because of one bad game, nor can you possibly make a reasonable generalization about the team, the offense, or the quality of the coaching from it. Hell, I'm on drugs and I can see that!
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MUfan
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 12:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thechuck_2112 wrote:
Hell. Between this an Davidson, I oughta just throw in the towel and root for Carolina for the rest of the year. Twisted Evil


I thought the popular team to root for was Duke! Wink

Seriously, it's a long season, and it's only one game. Hinkle is a very tough place to play. It's huge and it's tough to shoot the long ball there. I couldn't tell from the broadcast (was listening off and on), and it can get very loud there. Butler always seems to rise to the occasion when playing a quality opponent.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MUfan wrote:

I thought the popular team to root for was Duke! Wink

I have family issues with Duke. My dad went to Davidson and my uncle to Carolina. They're my other principal rooting interests.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thechuck_2112 wrote:
MUfan wrote:

I thought the popular team to root for was Duke! Wink

I have family issues with Duke. My dad went to Davidson and my uncle to Carolina. They're my other principal rooting interests.


I know - just giving you crap. Didn't you say one time last year that when you tried to get some friends down to Millett, they claimed there was a big Duke game on TV or something?
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No self-respecting native of the Bluegrass State will ever have a kind word to say about that school. The hatred of all things Laettner-tainted will live on into perpetuity!!
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, one of my best friends is a big Duke fan. Before the OU game, which was pretty important for conference standings, I tried to get him to come down to Millett. He said that Duke at Wake was much more important, and as a Duke fan, he had to watch it. We had had "the argument" about this 10,000 times (he's a Michigan football fan, too), so I let him be. While Miami beat OU, Duke lost to Wake, and it's entirely Brett's fault (I'm sure DG can back me up on this).
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Went to the game with Xanadu, and hooked up with Dick at Hinkle.

Hinkle is a treasure-a classic basketball arena. I only wish that the sun had been shining to see the rays filter through the windows. Butler fans reminded me of XU fans-very classy, know their basketball.

Losing to Butler has become the rule rather than the exception for Miami-overall, we are 1-10 now against the Bulldogs Crying or Very sad

As to the game, Moll made an excellent point-the Bulldogs were smart enough to play zone against us, and that hurt. No production out of the forward position from Little Nate or Monty. Butler was very hot in the second half. Their big 7'O" guy, ironically named 'Smalligen' has incredible touch on his outside shots. They have some great shooters, and they were as hot in the second half as we had been in the first two games. This was my first basketball game this year, and the player I really liked was Chad Troyer. Yes, he did turn the ball over and shot an airball, but I really liked his hustle and leadership at the guard position. I think that he will be a good one!
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 9:44 am    Post subject: Butler game Reply with quote

This is a blanket reply to several posts.

1. Butler did not zone you guys. They play a man to man with a lot of help off the ball, but they have not played more than 3 minutes of zone in the last two years.

2. We did not have all of our starters back. We had 3 starters back and we have no seniors.

3. Our normal radio guy was doing tv for the Wooden thing at Conseco.

The game was a physical, hard fought, but very clean contest. I think more than anything, coming off that X win, we caught you guys a little over confident.

Your coach is a class act and so is your team. Good luck the rest of the year.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 12:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Up here, the local paper is praising the CMU team for their hard-fought, physical win over Saginaw Valley. Yes, SVSU is a D-II team, who led CMU at halftime and as late as with 9 minutes left. CMU pulled out the win with something like 39-47 free throw shooting (don't remember the exact stats - I'm at work and don't have paper in front of me). While that FT shooting is good, it's sad that they needed that to beat a D-II team.

So yes, the Butler game was a game that could've been won, and the outside shooting and (lack of) inside game was a disappointment, I'll take two wins over quality opponents, and a loss at a very tough place to play over a team that always seems to rise to bigger opponents.
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